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I have a little problem with this. Am I wrong?
I don't think he's endorsing another Holocaust, but this is an extremely poorly chosen metaphor.
I am not gonna go into the rid the Jews comment, but if I remember correctly Hitler did try to deport them, but no country wanted them, can you blame them?
Not to mention the incredible suffering that was created by the forced relocation of the Jews.
E-mail much with Ahmadinejad?
Billy
This isn't something I'm all that concerned about with the illegals. The Jews were legal citizens who were ripped away from their property and neighborhoods. Illegal immigrants aren't in the same situation.
And yet that is exactly what most people who read your comment about "comfort" are going to think of next--even though it's clearly not what you meant and clearly not in keeping with your character.
Day has made a huge mistake here. But let's not forget that even the best of us can fall into a trap laid by the examples we choose in writing, and cut him a little bit of grace, OK?
I know I need to, as I've made some doozies of mistakes myself!
Another reason why Mass Deportation is an insane idea that has very litle political backing, by a two to one margin, and makes very little sense. The untold human suffering that would result is unimaginable. To brush it off as though it has no bearing is insane. We are not the type of country to force that type of suffering on 12 million people, citizens or not, and not care about it...
Oh give me a break. Empowering law enforcement to arrest illegals so that the number in this country can be reduced over time is hardly an insane idea, and deporting them to their home countries is hardly equivalent to the type of suffering the Jews went through in concentration camps.
Get a grip.
Children who can stay with their legal guardians, whever they go, until such a time as they can come here themselves and claim their citizenship.
You don't think there will be mass suffering as income, livelyhood, property, possesion, and familes are taken away from 10 million people in this country? You've gotta be realistic and mass deportaion just ain't realistic. Possible? Technically, but not plausable by any means.
The illegals are here and we have polititians to blame for it, not the illegals.
This kind of action can be acomplished in any country, if you can inflame the citizenry and pass some Special Laws.
Police officers arresting illegal immigrants? Illegal immigrants then being shipped across the border? I think it is entirely plausible, and the only argument against it I'm hearing from yhou is "12 million is a really big number and we can't do it!"
Not very convincing.
Right, but unfortunatley they are underage citizens and must stay with their parents until they can live here by themselves. I'm not saying they should be denied citizenship, just saying that they should stay with their parents until they can live here on their own.
Speak for yourself, bleeding heart.
And, of course, that's what the media would focus on. Just like how in Iraq they focus on the daily car bombings instead of on the overall fact that we're winning the war.
I'm sorry, but no quarter for criminals. This country is a representative democracy. The representatives of the people passed immigration laws, and these 12 million people thumbed their noses at it.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I am not in favor of seeing our laws walked on by anybody. Otherwise, what good is writing these laws at all?
And those kids would be eligible for foster care, since they are citizens and I would bet that most would find a way to keep those kids in the US since they are citizens adn we would be responsiblie to take care of them. No law could be passed to the contrary about those minors having to leave the country.
The country failed to enforce the laws, we all allowed this to happen. Oh puleese, Rob, we walk over our laws each and every day, we speed, we run stop signs, some cheat on their income taxes. Citizens thumb their noses at our laws every day.
Hell...some of us (you) even cheer them on and poo-poo any and every attempt at upholding the law. And then you have the nerve to spread blame? Ha!
experiment
This may be a Camino Browser problem. Only since site code was updated did I have any radio buttons/tags in Camino.
Later I will try Firefox.
Any party that is thought to be responsible for the suffering that would ensure because of mass deportation (just think of the daily onslaught from the MSM about the poor immigrants being sent home without a job and families seperated!) will overnight be demonized and marginalized on anything else it tried to do. You are advocating abandoning the entire conservative adgenda.
Really? You polled every single American citizen?
So the next time there is a wave of thefts here in Minot I guess we should all just push to solve it by making theft legal, right?
That makes lots of sense.
Some of us have been calling for border enforcement for years. It wasn't until the problem has reached the breaking point (with American citizens owning property along the border screaming for some protection from the hordes trespassing on their land, not to mention ER's and other public services being shutdown thanks to the number of illegals demanding service) that more people began to take the problem seriously.
These people aren't Americans. They didn't come here to be American. They came here to exploit our welfare state. That's it.
They should be sent packing, not rewarded with citizenship.
Where were you seven years ago when I was talking about the need for closing the borders? OH THAT'S RIGHT, YOU DIDN'T KNOW ME THEN.
Please...don't assume.
The president talked about his immmigration when he was campaigning for office. Where were you then?
I don't know. Where was I, since you seem to presume to know me better than myself?
Oooo, it's a hot button issue now and you're all jumping on the band wagon.
No. It's a hot button issue now and so I am louder about the problem.
You voted for Bush knowing his stance on immigration.
Yep. I also voted for Bush knowing that he spends like a liberal. Your point is?
So get off your high horse, Lik, and quit acting all so indignant!
You're an ignorant jackass Puzzlefeet.
Quit acting all so indignant Puzzlefeet. And drop the pompous ass attitude.
You're like a little kid who doesn't get it sometimes. You assume too much lady.
Puzzle, I've been pretty clear on the fact that Bush is dead wrong on illegal immigration. So much for me being a knee-jerk Bush-lover, eh? I'd better not hear anything like that come out of your mouth in my direction again.
As for him campaigning on it, I didn't much pay attention to the election in 2000. Too young then. Paid attention to the last election and I didn't hear him talk about it much at all.
I think the only reason Lik sounds excited is from laughing at your inanity. We've been clear about Bush being wrong on illegal immigration. That you don't get that is amazing.
And if by chance he does make good on this promise, who knows maybe He'll make good on His promise to the Christians who voted for him as well. But I doubt it again.
If you seriously think that immigrants from Mexico are going to be the end of our country, you are insane. If you also think that mass deportations will result in a "possible reorganization" of the GOP, you have no political sense whatsoever. It will be the end of the GOP leading America for a very, very, very long time.
No, but if crime were an acceptable way of life for 20 years and suddenly a new sherrif came in town, you couldn't just line everyone in town up and put them all in jail. You start enforcing the law from that point forward...
Our elected officials have let us down. Now that they have figured out they need to take care of this problem, let's take care of it and not go nuts by advocating absurd ideas like deporting 3% of the US population....
Please...don't assume." Then you wrote just above: "As for him campaigning on it, I didn't much pay attention to the election in 2000. Too young then. Paid attention to the last election and I didn't hear him talk about it much at all."
So Rob, you wrote were talking about closing the borders seven years ago, and then didn't pay too much attention to the election in 2000, because you were too young. Hmmm.....
OH, DocDave, you'd never vote democratic and you know it.
I think the bottom line here is that both sides are pretty hardened to their positions. So it will be interesting to watch how Pres. Bush threads this needle.
I'm the one who was discussing such political matters seven and more years ago. Rob was still politically ignorant. You switched us up.
I didn't write that first statement. I don't know who said that. Maybe you shouldn't put words I didn't write in my mouth.
Wow, who will I be next, Robert?
The Jews were legal citizens who were ripped away from their property and neighborhoods. Illegal
Kind of like the Palestinians, I guess.
Depends on what new names you invent for your multiple personalities. Not my call.
Thanks for the clarification Lik, my apologies to you as well.
Diane, obviously some think you are me and I am you. Some here can't believe that we are different posters. Easier for them, I guess.
Let'see....who shall I be next? Hmmmm......
No, the IP addresses are totally differnt.
It should not go unnoticed. You ask those that want to stay to pay their debt to society. They pay large fines for breaking the law and they spend time working toward citizenship. If they do not do this, they have received warning and are deported.
You don't have to take shots at me, Robert. But I am against simply blocking 3-4% of our population off from society. They are here, they need to come out of the shadows and be dealt with. It is in all of our interest that they not simply disappear. Our economy would suffer, our populous would suffer.
They are human beings living in America working, eating, renting, owning, buying, creating families, marrying etc. They are part of our society wether they have the proper paperwork or not. The point is they are integrated into our population and that isnt' going to change.
For the umpteenth time, it's not amnesty. They will be forced to meet standards and pay their debt to society through fines. They will be required to learn english. They will be required to be otherwise law-abiding citizens. They will have to have a job. That is not amnesty.
Meanwhile the people that have followed the law to emigrate here have to...wait.
I'm ready to be picked off by a third party.
Why exactly, tell me, do we need a new law?
No, the IP addresses are totally differnt
Good luck; he'll never believe it. It's known as living in a fantasy world.
The Palestinians were deported from their legal homes that they had lived in for generations. Maybe that's why they're so upset?
One reason mass deportation will not take place is that Bush wants them here. He and Fox are buddies, and Bush's corporate buddies need cheap labor.
Antonio DeRugosa, Mayor of Los Angeles, is one of the many Hispanic officials who will soon have the highest offices in the state and then in the country.
Get used to it and, may I say, your Bush wants it that way. He doesn't care because he's a globalist and the U.S. is just one country on his economic plate (personal economics of himself and other super rich/super powerful/elite).
It should be obvious to everyone by now.
I was disillusioned by him long ago, my mom was as of, oh, about 6 months to a year ago (open boarders/Medicare) and now some of you.
Only the very hardcore of the hardcore are still in fantasyland, and I think nothing will shake them (think famous painting 'Buffalo Herd' and/or lemming)
I was thinking about making a comment under the name Ira with a nice proxy from Israel and agree with my self :)
Hey, Whistler, don't get me all hot and bothered that you can be picked of by third party, I just don't think it's possible because when push comes to shove, you'll probably vote Repub. if only to stop the Ds from taking over.
Spahgnum, I've tried all those arguments, it is deportation and a wall or nothing. As I've said their positions are hardened, nothing will appease them other than a wall and deportation of 12 million workers and their citizen children.
Yeah, that's what frustrates me the most... those here that are going to belittle Bush and tell him how wrong he is unless every illegal is deported an a 20-foot wall is built from the Gulf to the Pacific... It's absurd....
I live 5 miles from a checkpoint; I've seen it firsthand.
I've supported Bush (or given him a pass) on every other thing he's done. I haven't liked his spending.
It's a simple thing. When you catch them you kick them out. What's hard about that. It doesn't even take a new law.
Sphag: They are not "our population". They are draining our country in several ways, and they are not assimilating. They don't want to learn the language, to a great extent. They want us to accomodate them. As a resident of Southern CA, I encounter this on a daily basis. We cannot ignore illegal behavior, especially to this degree, without losing at least some of our national identity. Once again, the "mass deportation" strawman argument. We build the wall, we lock down the border, we dry up the jobs, we cut off the welfare. Maybe they will return home and work hard to improve their own countries. What's wrong with that?
I think you're being a bit too hatsh in your assessment. Most people recognize the enormity of trying to deport 12 million illegals... although I suspect one the first 1 or 2 million have been deported, the rest would not likely hang around to see who'd be next.
But what most people on the Right want is the proper priority. Get control of the border first! Then deal with the illegals who are here. To lump it all together in some sort of bi-lingual sausage casing is ultimately going to satisfy no one. A goovernment that cannot control its own borders, regardless of the rationalizations offered, is likely to have no more credibility abroad than it does at home.
Regardless of which side of the Israeli wall your sympathies may lie on, the fact. ike it not, is that it has been effective in cutting down on suicide bombings, its original purpose.
There are many of me, and we are all coming after YOU.
(Theme from Twilight Zone playing in the background)
Give me a break. We know you won't ever vote D. We just love to watch you dance R108.
Too bad it hasn't cut down on immoral killing of Palestinians by Israelis, who have to keep going outside their wall to do it.
What I find most amusing is the underlying story. Iraq is over. We took out the terrorist headquarters last week, and the documents we found revealed that their movement is in tatters. Now, the lefties who have been carrying on a jihad against the President for five years over Iraq have to jump to a new issue
Link? Iraq is over? You're hilarious, Robert!
Now, you are trying to align with the President, which is really a laugh, and try to drive out the conservatives
The last thing in the WORLD I can think of I'm trying to do is align with this 'President'. Yuk, the thought is nauseating. I frankly could care less what conservatives do, but I find it interesting that he finally has been able to alienate all but his most hardcore and nonthinking followers. He even alienated my mom. Amazing.
If it was from the same location, going throught the same ISP, they IPs would be similar if not identiacal. They are different people.
I live in CA as well. I see it as well. And yes, they are part of the US population. You use a big "they" to cover everything you don't like about the general illegal population but much of what you are saying is giong to be addressed. Those that don't speak the language are going to be sent home. Those that do not provide for themselves (dont' ahve a job) will be sent home. These problems ARE being addressed by the President and Congress. You ahve to conceed that, hopefully the final resolution contains these elements.
Fair enough. This, I do understand. I just wish it were said more clearly and loudly by some. Some appear not to be satisfied unless every one of their suggestions (wall, deportaion, learn english, no welfare, etc) is met. I just wish those would give this Congress and Bush the enormous credit they deserve for taking this problem head on, instead of ignoring it like the last 10 Congresses have, and coming up with common sense solutions and that will,in the end, help to fix the problem.
Okay, is it settled or not? Are we different people or aren't we? I, for one, would appreciate a definite answer. ;P
I'm so confused Diane, are we the same person or are we clones, god, don't let them know that or it will be the next speech Bush has to give to appease them.
Oh, well, do we really care, this is just too much fun. Keep it up Diane (even though we don't agree all the time, just enough to keep them confused.)
Why do I wonder if they will actually enforce the law? That's a serious question.
We have a President and many members of Congress that are ready to reward the lawbreakers.
President Bush said we need a guest worker program where they'd also return home. (Frankly I don't like that, I'd rather take people that want to become Americans and let them take the jobs.) Right now I doubt that the guest workers would ever be sent home.
If we are unwilling to enforce the laws it means any of the (immigration) laws are worthless.
No, BobbyBoy has had me as jason (not from the horror move, though he might), WETBACK (I think), and probably others I forget at the moment.
But, though not the first, you'll always be special.
Granted. I guess I just have faith that all this talk has got to result int he law being enforced once it is brought up to date. I guess I just give them the benifit of the doubt on that point...
diane must not pay too much attention because if she did, she would realize that all of the resident conservatives here regularly disagree with Bush on a number of key issues. That she continues to say ignorant things like "hard-core Bush supporters" shows that she either doesn't pay attention or is willfully ignorant.
BTW, I happen to support immigration reform and increased border security...but I also know that there are a lot of hispanics out there picking grapes and pruning and working the fields and I don't see Americans falling all over themselves to take these jobs. So maybe a worker program of some sort might be a good idea. Unless of course all those foaming at the mouth key board pounders out there would like to play like Okies in the Dust Bowl.
I don't.
Reagan gave in to illegal immigration, now Bush wants to give in. Both times we tell ourselves "this will be the last time. It will be fixed after this."
This isn't a good trend.
Billy
There is no trend. It happened once in the 1980's and when they passed the amnesty, they didn't follow through with the enforcment. This time I have faith that they will follow through with enforcment. Bush isn't caving on anything, he's fully in support of enforcment.
Whether it's fair to those who've been cut-in-line on, is a different question of course. (I understand there may be an upcoming Minuteman political ad hitting on this latter issue.)
No link!...very funny...very telling...very truthful
http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5500
P: read the link, then get back to me. Your rants are both incoherent. So now you believe Bush, Rice and Rumsfeld, you hypocrite?
because obviously our Government don't care what we want.
Pushing more lefty propaganda again, eh? The facts are that our budget debt measured as a percentage of GDP is at 2.7%, which is exactly the 40-year median value. Not great, but not "huge," unless you're a Bush hater looking for something to bitch about....
Secondly the budget deficit has not been driven by military spending (though that has helped) but by entitlement spending, which has surged from less than 50% of our budget 20 years ago to nearly 2/3s of the budget in 2006.
Dropping military spending may help, but that is uncertain, because part of the military spending actually stimulates economic activity. Entitlement spending, on the other hand, never does.
Robert108 is right. The war in Iraq for all intents and purposes is over. It is a matter of time before the insurgency collapses on itself. The bigger lingering question (which was always there, just missed by myopic Bush haters) is whether Iraq could hang together as a nation, or splinter off into a set of Balkan-like states. That would be a failure of the Bush doctrine of course, but it was the main danger from day one, and not an insurgency that could only survive by killing women and children (to the cheering of you folks on the left).
I'm pretty sure that part of the legislation is going to be that these illegals that apply for citizenship will have to get in line behind everyone that is in process now... I'm not really so sure on this point, but the issue is at least being addressed on Capitol Hill (and by Bush) I believe...
Billy
Billy Rubin on May 16, 2006 at 9:07 AM
Hey, Billy...why don't you look at the title of the thread? I'm not the one who started anything about Jews. And I talk about Israelis or Israeli Jews, not Jews en masse. I talk about Israeli Jews who are persecuting Palestinians. Of course, you are blind to that, which means you must support it?
Robert, for the sake of clarity, do you agree with the following statment?
You seem to have this notion that anyone in this country illegally, or at least the vast majority of them, are not otherwise law abiding citizens and are going to be the death of our country. Can you explain your position on this?
The question is not whether the illegals are "good" or "hard working" people. The question is whether or not they're pulling their fair share of the load. They're not, mostly because their illegal status marginalizes them.
Now, you'll respond to that by saying "Let's make them legal." Well, I say we can't do that becaues it will only provide incentive for more to come here.
Bottom line: Regardless of whether or not they're "good people," the are a burden on our society...and rewarding them for coming here with clemency is only going to make the problem worse.
Actually, as you just said making them legal takes care of that problem.... but that's not my point. My point is that Robert seems to think these people are inherently criminal simply because they hopped the border. I'm just asking if this is a correct assesment of his view of illegals or if I'm interpretting it wrong. I'm going for clarity here...
Clear enough?
Obviously they broke the law in coming here. The relevent question is, are these people somehow worse people than the immigrants that get greencards. Does the fact that they have hopped the border make them detrimentally worse for our country.
Let me explain it this way. If I lived in Mexico, I would try with all my power and ability to get into America. Legally immigrating isn't really an option for a starving family in the corrupt country like Mexico. They dont' have time to wait. So were I in their shoes, I would gladly risk it all and hop the border. But I am an otherwise law abiding person and if the legal option was there I would take it.
So why should I be cast as a terrible, scumbag of a person who is going to be the death of America?
Yes, because immigrants who are here with greencards displayed a respect for our system of democracy and laws that is present with the illegals. They thumbed their noses at our laws, jumped our border and laid claim to the benefits of our welfare state.
That makes them inherently worse people.
It turns out that it is possible to file federal & state taxes without a social security number. You just need something called an "individual tax identification number" or ITIN which you can get without having to establish legal residency in the United States, or even that you have entered the United States legally. (Massive loophole created by the IRS because the $$$ is more important to them than solving the illegal immigration problem.)
As to your comment:
That is only true if they have a job to come to.
We have discussed mechanisms for preventing illegals from entering and working in this country before. That can be made to work, if the national will is there.
In order to reach the conclusion you have arrived at, you have to start by assuming that we don't have the national will. In which case, it's already hopeless! That sure looks like circular reasoning to me.
If we accept that a solution is possible, then what I have been advocating looks to be the most promising. Accomplish the following in this order 1) border security, 2) deny employment, and then 3) address what to do with the illegals here (the latter intentionally left hazy).
Based on the assumption that anything can be made to work, why is this not as optimal as we are likely to get?
A little over the top, Sphag. With all their hard work and energy, why don't they work to make their own country more like ours? They are not entitled to eat at our trough because their own countries are screwed up. They could ask for our help, rather than illegally invading another country. Just a thought. After we lock down the border, turn off the tap to employment and welfare, and deport the illegals, we can talk about streamlining the legal process from a position of strength.
...and this...
How can you say that most are paying federal and state taxes? I'll grant sales taxes as they can't be avoided, but are you asking me to believe that these people who couldn't be bothered to follow our immigration laws are now voluntarily following our tax laws?
Unless you've got some other data to indicate otherwise, I'm not inclined to believe that.
The only conclusion I have arrived at is that illegal immigrants are costing this country money. The national will I see us lacking is the will to crack down on these people rather than give up and grant them amnesty.
You see to imply that I don't think there is a solution. I do think there is a solution, and I've put it forth several times. It is, in fact, very similar to yours:
1) Secure the border.
2) Deny the illegals jobs
3) Empower local law enforcement to arrest illegals as we come across them and then speedily deport them once they are arrested.
That last one is probably the only place where you and I differ, though your position on what to do with those who are here seems to be changing.
Look, I'm an immigrant and a naturalized US citizen. The illegal aliens should be deported. I don't care what the liberals say. Or the conservatives. If you break the law, you must pay the price. It's that simple. (If you think it's impossible, outsource it to Japanese immigration enforcement officers or to Korean immigration enforcement officers. They'll jail, fine, and deport illegal aliens and deny them any more entries into the country. Japan won't let you in for ten years since the deportation even if you marry a Japanese citizen.)
Furthermore, why give them US citizenship? They broke our law once. What makes you think they won't do it again? Their attitude is "I'm poor and desperate, so I'm gonna grab what I can for myself and screw everyone else."
Not the kind of people I want to have in my country.
And if you don't like the wall, there's always another option: landmines.
Even the so-called Native Americans immigrated here. Saying that we are a "nation of immigrants" is meaningless. The important part is: "We are a nation."
PART I
Actually, I don't see it that way at all.
Mass deportation is a canard. Not even necessary. I used to know a real interesting guy, Mike Zink. 82nd Airborne in Korea, 25 years in the FBI fighting organized crime. Later as chief of security for a major international corporation. He told me over lunch how they rooted out Mafiosi, "follow the money. Dry it up. " In counterintel it worked the same for what was called 'illegals' or those foreign agents not working under diplomatic cover. You found their money, cut it off, they'd have to come up for air in short order.
The same holds true here. What draws the illegals to the USA? Money. They are dirt-poor in their own countries. Their own countries are unwilling or unable to fix their own poverty problem and so they export their poor to the USA. Another big plus, the illegals then send home US dollars, called remittances. It's big money in aggregate, bigger even than oil and tourism for Mexico. As Al Pacino would've said 'da's ah lodda faakin' mah-nee"
You dry up the money and the benefits, the illegals won't have anywhere to go but home. These folks are very mobile. They'll self-deport. Really. Cut off the money and they'll go home. No mass round-ups necessary.
Who benefits from illegal immigration?
Corporations. Businesses large and small. No more minium wage. No taxes, federal, state or local. No OSHA, No FICA, No COLA. No EPA or EEOC regs. Illegals won't say jack to predatory practics. Such employers undercut competitors in every way -- driving US businesses who run their shop by employing Americans and playing by the rules out of business. This has another effect, it drives low- and entry-level wage earners off the market. If you are in construction, in the hotel business, in factory work AND you are American, you can pretty much kiss your job good-bye. It's also happening with Engineers, Doctors, Nurses and other skilled professions through abuse of the H1-B visa program.
Now, we see that law-abiding businesses and American workers are harmed by illegal immigration and the dirt-bags, big and small, benefit. They have the ear of Big Business Democrats and Republicans.
The only group that fought against Amnesty for Illegals were the Republican House and non-RINO Senate. Luckily, a lot of RINO's got kicked out in this go-round. But the American base -- oddly enough, both Democrat and Republican -- are highly pissed that their leadership are tone-deaf to their anger.
Tom Tancredo may throw his hat in the ring. We'll see if this issue catches fire or not. I predict it will. Those marches by millions of illegal invaders chanting 'si se pueda' REALLY pissed off a lot of Americans.
END PART I
Again, mass deportations are not necessary. All you need to do is cut off the money. Here's how you do it:
1) You give all illegals a reverse amnesty. If you are here illegally and you leave the United States within two months, you will have an opportunity to apply for re-entry. Basically, you get in line, but from you home country of origin. BUT, if we catch you here after 2 months and one day, you are deported and banned from reentry for life. No worries about paperwork, you just set dates. From July 7, 2007, you have 60 days. Day 61 is on the calaendar for all to see. If Pancho is caught in a traffic stop on day 61, he is processed for expedited exclusion proceedings -- Red Rocket, pal.
[Subcutaneous RFIDs would help in this regard, planted near the brain stem, so they can't be cut out with a pocket knife. But not really necessary]
2) Dry up the benefits
No more benefits for anyone not a US citizen or here legally (green card holder). Nix, nada, zilch. No foodstamps, no medicaid, no school lunches, no schools, no emergency rooms, nuthing. You go home for all that.
3) Deputize every LEO pursuant to section 287(g) of the Immigration Reform Act. That means any traffic stop, any arrest for a domestic disturbance, any contact with any LEO can result in collection for deportation.
4) Harshly penalize employers who employ illegals. I-9 fraud and tax evasion, identity theft are all possible legal mechanisms for prosecution on every level. A couple raids, a couple criminal charges with CEO's being frogwalked out of their offices for FOX TV NEWs will start making corporations feel the heat and then they will see the light.
5) Violation of the US Frontier is at least a misdemeanor, repeat violation IS a felony. Sentence, 6 months hard labor, followed by deportation. Hard Labor? Yes. Building the full-length US-Mexico Wall!
6) Property and children. Noone should benefit from their wrong. They were on notice that they were breaking the law when they waded the Rio Grande, hopped the fence and scurried through traffic. Any goods, currency or possessions are 'fruits of the poisonous tree' and are properly seized to defray the cost of their apprehension and exclusion.
Children, of course, need to be re-united with their families -- in Mexico! It's not punishment, we're just sending them home.
7) No more anchor babies. No more ius solis (law of the soil or I'm here so ollie ollie oxen free. If you are here ILLEGALLY -- you go home. Change it to Ius Sanguinus - law of the blood, legal blood that is.
Once the money is dried up, once the Wall is built, once the fetters have been taken off the Border Patrol, and once the host countries realize that the US is serious about cutting off remittances and defending our border, it will trickle down to nothing and pretty much stop.
What you have now is a government which has refused to enforce the laws we have on the books, and the voters are livid.
Tancredo might well be president -- on this issue alone.