Have you considered the possibility that Michael Berg hates America and everything it stands for? We might want to look into that.
Perry Thompson
· 3 years ago
Michael Berg is one of the most courageous Americans I've encountered in many years. A hero. A father. A patriot. I don't often say this: Berg makes me PROUD to be an American citizen.
Right on, dude!
Peace, Perry Thompson
likwidshoe
· 3 years ago
Michael Berg is one of the most courageous Americans I've encountered in many years. A hero.
What makes him "courageous" and "a hero"?
robert108
· 3 years ago
Dave: Seems pretty obvious to me. I think you have this one 100% right.
robert108
· 3 years ago
Cindy Sheehan loses her son in battle as a US soldier, and blames the US. Michael Berg loses his son as a hostage to terrorists, and blames the US when we kill the terrorist who killed his son. What unites the two? They are both lefties. Maybe there is a theme here.
janet
· 3 years ago
Michael Bergs son was in Iraq to make big money. If he had not been so greedy, he would still be alive. He could have stayed in the US and worked. His father needs to move to Iraq and help those people if he doesn't like our US government.
Jim
· 3 years ago
This Berg guy is an idiot. He needs to stop smoking that grass that all of his other 1960's buddies quit smoking in the early eighties and join the 21st century. Just what we need... a pacifist moron in congress. Does his "make love, not war" philosophy mean that after another attack on U.S. citizens that he will discuss it over a bong with the insurgent leader who ordered the attack? This guy needs to go to the front lines and personally witness some of the stuff that goes on. It's bad enough we have enemies abroad, do we need one in political office at home, too? NO!
likwidshoe
· 3 years ago
This Berg guy is an idiot. He needs to stop smoking that grass that all of his other 1960's buddies quit smoking in the early eighties and join the 21st century. Just what we need... a pacifist moron in congress.
Smoking weed does not make one an idiot on the magnitude of Michael Berg nor does it make one a pacifist willing to bow to Islamic thugs. You're letting him off easy by suggesting elsewise.
In other words: Michael Berg is a dhimmi idiot because Michael Berg is a dhimmi idiot. Weed, nor alcohol, nor even hard hallucinogenics can be blamed for such positions.
robert108
· 3 years ago
None of them increase your IQ or your ability to think clearly.
likwidshoe
· 3 years ago
None of them increase your IQ or your ability to think clearly.
True that...was just making the point that Michael Berg doesn't have that as an excuse. He is what he is because of who he is.
All for naught in any regard. I know Jim was just using hyperbole for effect. I was just playing along. :)
Action Jackson
· 3 years ago
Berg is still confused about who killed his kid? News flash: Al Zarkawi is on an internet video and sawing your kid's head off with a dull knife!
Man, and this fool doesn't know who did it or if it was a good thing the #1 terrorist in Iraq was killed? Worse yet, he's running for Congress...sick, sick, sick, typical liberal wacko.
Action Jackson
· 3 years ago
Hey, as blogs go this is a pretty cool site, thought I would share...
joyce
· 3 years ago
Can you imagine blaming the President because Zarqawi sawed his head off from his breathing body? We all saw it. Nick wasn't even in the military....he was there voluntarily! How can he blame Bush for THAT? He's an idiot! This guy is a tool of the Left now and he was a tool before his son died. His head is planted firmly up his own radical ass.
joyce
· 3 years ago
In my wildest imagination I cannot understand blaming the President because Zarqawi sawed his son's head off from his living body! We all saw it....it was barbaric and the worst way I can think to die. No glory, horrifying, agonizing, humiliating...evil. Nick wasn't even in the military....he was there voluntarily! How can he blame Bush for THAT? He's an idiot! This guy is a tool of the Left now and he was a tool before his son died. His head is planted firmly up his own radical ass.
diane
· 3 years ago
Michael Berg is one of the most courageous Americans I've encountered in many years. A hero. A father. A patriot. I don't often say this: Berg makes me PROUD to be an American citizen.
Right on, dude!
Peace, Perry Thompson Perry Thompson on June 8, 2006 at 10:37 AM
*********
Hear, hear, Perry!
******
Joyce, didn't you love those American shoes and watches and the 'dumb American football player' stance of the 'beheaders'? Makes me wonder. And those Wal-Mart white resin chairs shore do get around, don't they? That had C.I.A. all over it, or Mossad, or SAS.
From what I understand, Michael Berg was at Abu Ghraib working shortly before he was beheaded. What did he see that he wasn't supposed to..or hear, if anything? Who knows?
Yes, he was there to make money but why should that make his dad a bad guy? The old idiot, coward, traitor kind of junk sure flies hot and heavy here unless it's toe-ing the old NeoCON line.
likwidshoe
· 3 years ago
Joyce, didn't you love those American shoes and watches and the 'dumb American football player' stance of the 'beheaders'? Makes me wonder. And those Wal-Mart white resin chairs shore do get around, don't they? That had C.I.A. all over it, or Mossad, or SAS.
IT'S ALL A CONSPIRACY CONTROLLED BY THE EVIL NEOCON JEW AMERICANS AND THE JEW JEW JEW MOSSAD! THEY CONTROL YOUR MEDIA AND YOU DUMB AMERICANS LAP IT UP!!
Yes, he was there to make money but why should that make his dad a bad guy? The old idiot, coward, traitor kind of junk sure flies hot and heavy here unless it's toe-ing the old NeoCON line.
MICHAEL THINKS HIS OWN SON WAS A JEW LOVER CONTROLLED ZOMBIE!!11!1 HE WAS TOE-ING THE OLD NEOCON CONTROL THE WORLD LINE!!!1!!
....ugh....
I just had another diane moment. My mind now feels wretched.
diane
· 3 years ago
My....you only see "Jews" in front of your bleary eyes when I named three possibilities: CIA, Mossad, SAS.
Is it your shift to run to the defense of Israel, or do y'all switch off?
Intense.
robert108
· 3 years ago
How courageous is it to toe the leftie line when he is pandering to his leftie base in order to get elected to public office? He is just another pandering politician who, like Cindy Sheehan, using his dead son to get MSM attention for political power! Ann Coulter got it exactly right.
likwidshoe
· 3 years ago
diane spews more garbage, My....you only see "Jews" in front of your bleary eyes when I named three possibilities: CIA, Mossad, SAS.
No diane. I was just taking some of your previous writings into my mini-diane delusion comment.
Is it your shift to run to the defense of Israel, or do y'all switch off?
Get a grip lady.
robert108
· 3 years ago
likwid: Last time I looked, Israel is our ally. Therefore, we support them. It isn't rocket science.
robert108
· 3 years ago
Rob: "Hiding behind our borders..." Now that's funny! Ask some private property owners who live near our southern border about that one.
Mike Nowicki
· 3 years ago
Michael Berg needs to get out of this country and move to a Communist country.
He is a joke and a disgrace, his son was nothing more than a "gold digger" looking for a fast buck and had no reason to be in Iraq other than greed.
To call President Bush a terrorist and blame him for the beheading of his son is outrageous.
I am so sick of these idiots on the left bitching and complaining about the war efforts when in all reality if not for our brave soldiers they might not have the freedom to talk like morons on a daily basis.
joyce
· 3 years ago
That's right Diane....it's the joooooo's fault. It's ALWAYS the joooooo's fault. And the neo-cons, who are just jooooooo's afterall.
Why is Diane a Jew-hater? Maybe she got dumped by some Jewish guy in high school. Who could blame the guy?
Hey, Diane.....your favorite American, Mike Berg, is a jooooooo. Did you know that? But he's a good jooooo...because he's a self-hating joooo, right Diane?
diane
· 3 years ago
I am so sick of these idiots on the left bitching and complaining about the war efforts when in all reality if not for our brave soldiers they might not have the freedom to talk like morons on a daily basis.
Mike Nowicki on June 9, 2006 at 10:25 AM
Well, boo hooo Mike. I'm so sick of your right wing dunderheads bitching about Muslims and Iraqis who did nothing to you and killing them wholesale. The people killing them in our military uniforms have done NOTHING to make it possible for me to say what I say, nor you. Alot of them got into the military for an education or job without ever dreaming they would be sent by a Dufus to an immoral, illegal, anti-Constitutional occupation.
********
That's right Diane....it's the joooooo's fault. It's ALWAYS the joooooo's fault. And the neo-cons, who are just jooooooo's afterall.
Why is Diane a Jew-hater? Maybe she got dumped by some Jewish guy in high school. Who could blame the guy?
Hey, Diane.....your favorite American, Mike Berg, is a jooooooo. Did you know that? But he's a good jooooo...because he's a self-hating joooo, right Diane?
joyce on June 9, 2006 at 8:00 PM
Actually jhoyce, I wondered if YOU knew it? I thought he was. See, I'm not the jooooo hater at all...it's you who hate anyone, including Jews, apparently, who aren't on 'your side of the argument'.
You're so dang duplicitous, Joyce. And why do you say jooooooooooo instead of Jew? Is it hard for you to spell it out?
diane
· 3 years ago
By the whay, jhoyce, are you an anti-semitic Arab hater?
diane
· 3 years ago
His father needs to move to Iraq and help those people if he doesn't like our US government.
janet on June 8, 2006 at 4:09 PM
Stop telling people who disagree with your sadistic war they should leave the country.
You leave it, lady.
Mike
· 3 years ago
"Well, boo hooo Mike. I'm so sick of your right wing dunderheads bitching about Muslims and Iraqis who did nothing to you and killing them wholesale."
Hey Diane the Moronlady, did you not see or remember the streets in the Middle East after 9/11 and all of the idiots clapping and cheering when the Towers came down ? I suppose that was just ?
If President Bush was an idiot or a killer, like the majority of you leftys think he is, he would have done what I want and make the Middle East a GLASS PARKING LOT, then all the Religious fanatics can be dead and Allah can sort em' out !
I am the one tired of the Left- tree hugging, give peace a chance bullshit spewers with the double talk and the lies. You are all a bunch of spineless, mindless morons. Be happy you have a leader who is more worried about the safety of this nation than making everyone happy, basically being a politician.
likwidshoe
· 3 years ago
diane dribbles out, I'm so sick of your right wing dunderheads bitching about Muslims and Iraqis who did nothing to you and killing them wholesale.
Muslims haven't done anything to us? News to me. I look back at recent history and see a bunch of instances of "the religion of peace" terrorizing the world.
As for killing Iraqis "wholesale", if we really did that, they'd all be dead today. It wouldn't be that hard for our military to wipe out 25 million people.
Alot of them got into the military for an education or job...
Well, tough shit for those guys. Unlucky for them that they were actually called to duty. You don't mention the record high re-enlistment rates though...wonder why?
...without ever dreaming they would be sent by a Dufus to an immoral, illegal, anti-Constitutional occupation.
Great argument there. Not only do you call our President a "Dufus", but you twist the meanings of the words "immoral", "illegal", and "anti-Constitutional" to be the exact opposite of reality.
See, I'm not the jooooo hater at all...it's you who hate anyone, including Jews, apparently, who aren't on 'your side of the argument'.
Wait, when it's not the "Jewish PNAC's" who are "on our side", they're not on our side? Ummm..whatever.
Stop telling people who disagree with your sadistic war they should leave the country.
"Sadistic"? This war has been remarkably clean on our end with only a few blights. I guess you could call it sadistic in one respect: when the wounded enemy stops shooting, we rush in to give him medical aid.
You leave it, lady.
Why would Joyce have to leave? She's not a terrorist supporting communist. Michael Berg is. Berg should leave. He hates everything this country stands for.
derrick
· 3 years ago
To anyone with a clue- As a "person who joined the military to get an education" and a war monger/baby killer etc.etc. who has been to Iraq.I have this too say...Unfortunately you liberals wont like this.So turn away now. Nick Berg was a stupid asshole who went to Iraq looking too make money.He went without government sanction.When the government advised him too take his stupid ass home he did his own thing and got his head cut off for his choices,While i find this act despicable he did bring it on himself.Look at his demographics...Jewish and American in a country where they hate both with equal veracity....duh!! He brought his fate on himself.For his father to blame the government for his death is total BS.He was an adult who made his own competent descision and suffered the consequences as a result.Im tired of libs preaching free mind then when it blows up in some ones face its everyones fault but the individual that made that decision. As it has been pointed out previously Mr. Berg is a jew.I am sure this will be called "anti-semetic" but for the cries about the Halocaust,which did happen....I have been too Dachau and felt the death there.Why do our Jewish politicians such as Mr. Berg call for Gun Control...which was a Nazi Party plank and made the jews victims since they gave up thier guns when Hitler demanded it,and abortion rights which is the murder of innocents such as the Halocaust was.Pacifism is a nice idea but it has been realistically out of style since Cain dropped Abel.For all the libs that want to scream about racism etc.I promise you my babygirl is black and I love her for life.I am conservative but as I watch the so called conservatives self destruct over greed,and the libs try to turn this country into the Soviet Union,I am just a soldier keeping my watch.Oh by the way...Im a medic...A non-combatant and I willingly choose to serve my country in the fashion.Perhaps civilian non-combatants like Mr.Berg need to relocate themselves to France...Im sure he would be welcome there. Just A Medic Me
TwoHotel9
· 3 years ago
Doc, if you are on the level and honest in your post, then welcome in. If not, you have come to the wrong blog. Civs in general, and those of a left leaning nature inparticular, do not have any concept of what the military is or does. They see it as being the same as local cops and firefighters and EMTs. And that is just not correct. Are you still AD, and are you going back across the water?
TwoHotel9
· 3 years ago
No, to the Medic in the post above. Sorry to confuse, forgiveness please, kiss feet. I was using the universal"Doc" that troops always use with medics.
Derrick
· 3 years ago
Im for real....too real...I am hoping to go back in September...Ironiccaly after 9-11 the military caused me a few credit headaches and now they want to yank my security clearance...its almost laughable.If I survive this I am to go back in September....Im USAF reserve now and even though my pay may be late from time to time...and they screw up the travel card...Its better then being Army Guard and getting cornholed like i did in 2001.I have actually been in a depression due to the fact they brought me home.Im the exception to the rule.I have no family.friends or loved ones...They can even keep the tax free status and combat pay.Regardless of who i treated I did my job to the best of my ability.The sick thing is up until recently I was a correctional officer...to have INMATES who are nothing but a drain on society,call u a traitor for treating enemy sick and wounded was WAY too much too take.
Bat One
· 3 years ago
Derrick,
Thank you for your service. Regardless of what other consequences you may have endured since, please know that there are many of us who do appreciate your sacrifice.
TwoHotel9
· 3 years ago
Don't let it get you down. Getting screwed is the price of admission. If your credit problem was caused by Finance just keep making the point, the Big Green Machine is slow yet thorough.
Jack
· 3 years ago
Two US soldiers who went missing after an attack on their checkpoint have been found dead and were tortured before being killed, an Iraqi defence official says."
This is an outrage and if this had been done to a couple terrorists held in Gitmo, no doubt Muslim fanatics from Tehran to Islamobad would be out in the streets threatening death to Americans. Well, it's not the average American's thing to take their anger to the streets and beat our chests bloody with rage, but we will be happy to bloody the enemy that did that attrocity.
What follows will be done in a steely calm. It will be done carefully and deliberately. It is taking shape at this moment, somewhere, in a secure strategic operations room, far from the media and the primitive terrorists, who mistakenly think they are out of reach of justice. If they could only see what the future holds for them, it would be far more disturbing than a mere mob chanting death threats.
We the people, acting through our President and our military will soon take care of what must be done. When it is over, it will not be punctuated by bravado or politicizing, it will simply be closure for the victim's families and an end to the unremarkable lives of a few insignificant, but truly evil fanatics.
TwoHotel9
· 3 years ago
You are right, the response will be carried forward with steely calm. You just have the location wrong. It will move forward from TOCs and Company HQs, from Platoon fighting positions and quite discussions between NCOs over cold chow and lukewarm instant coffee. It has, in matter of point, moved forward already. Ask the terrorists and watch the fear in their eyes as they deny it.
All Comments
Right on, dude!
Peace,
Perry Thompson
What makes him "courageous" and "a hero"?
Smoking weed does not make one an idiot on the magnitude of Michael Berg nor does it make one a pacifist willing to bow to Islamic thugs. You're letting him off easy by suggesting elsewise.
In other words: Michael Berg is a dhimmi idiot because Michael Berg is a dhimmi idiot. Weed, nor alcohol, nor even hard hallucinogenics can be blamed for such positions.
True that...was just making the point that Michael Berg doesn't have that as an excuse. He is what he is because of who he is.
All for naught in any regard. I know Jim was just using hyperbole for effect. I was just playing along. :)
Man, and this fool doesn't know who did it or if it was a good thing the #1 terrorist in Iraq was killed? Worse yet, he's running for Congress...sick, sick, sick, typical liberal wacko.
Right on, dude!
Peace,
Perry Thompson
Perry Thompson on June 8, 2006 at 10:37 AM
*********
Hear, hear, Perry!
******
Joyce, didn't you love those American shoes and watches and the 'dumb American football player' stance of the 'beheaders'? Makes me wonder. And those Wal-Mart white resin chairs shore do get around, don't they? That had C.I.A. all over it, or Mossad, or SAS.
From what I understand, Michael Berg was at Abu Ghraib working shortly before he was beheaded. What did he see that he wasn't supposed to..or hear, if anything? Who knows?
Yes, he was there to make money but why should that make his dad a bad guy? The old idiot, coward, traitor kind of junk sure flies hot and heavy here unless it's toe-ing the old NeoCON line.
IT'S ALL A CONSPIRACY CONTROLLED BY THE EVIL NEOCON JEW AMERICANS AND THE JEW JEW JEW MOSSAD! THEY CONTROL YOUR MEDIA AND YOU DUMB AMERICANS LAP IT UP!!
*dribbling spit all over my bib*
AHAHAYAHAAHYAYAYAYAHHAHAH*dribble*spit*AHAYAHAYAHA
Yes, he was there to make money but why should that make his dad a bad guy? The old idiot, coward, traitor kind of junk sure flies hot and heavy here unless it's toe-ing the old NeoCON line.
MICHAEL THINKS HIS OWN SON WAS A JEW LOVER CONTROLLED ZOMBIE!!11!1 HE WAS TOE-ING THE OLD NEOCON CONTROL THE WORLD LINE!!!1!!
....ugh....
I just had another diane moment. My mind now feels wretched.
CIA, Mossad, SAS.
Is it your shift to run to the defense of Israel, or do y'all switch off?
Intense.
CIA, Mossad, SAS.
No diane. I was just taking some of your previous writings into my mini-diane delusion comment.
Is it your shift to run to the defense of Israel, or do y'all switch off?
Get a grip lady.
He is a joke and a disgrace, his son was nothing more than a "gold digger" looking for a fast buck and had no reason to be in Iraq other than greed.
To call President Bush a terrorist and blame him for the beheading of his son is outrageous.
I am so sick of these idiots on the left bitching and complaining about the war efforts when in all reality if not for our brave soldiers they might not have the freedom to talk like morons on a daily basis.
Why is Diane a Jew-hater? Maybe she got dumped by some Jewish guy in high school. Who could blame the guy?
Hey, Diane.....your favorite American, Mike Berg, is a jooooooo. Did you know that? But he's a good jooooo...because he's a self-hating joooo, right Diane?
Mike Nowicki on June 9, 2006 at 10:25 AM
Well, boo hooo Mike. I'm so sick of your right wing dunderheads bitching about Muslims and Iraqis who did nothing to you and killing them wholesale. The people killing them in our military uniforms have done NOTHING to make it possible for me to say what I say, nor you.
Alot of them got into the military for an education or job without ever dreaming they would be sent by a Dufus to an immoral, illegal, anti-Constitutional occupation.
********
That's right Diane....it's the joooooo's fault. It's ALWAYS the joooooo's fault. And the neo-cons, who are just jooooooo's afterall.
Why is Diane a Jew-hater? Maybe she got dumped by some Jewish guy in high school. Who could blame the guy?
Hey, Diane.....your favorite American, Mike Berg, is a jooooooo. Did you know that? But he's a good jooooo...because he's a self-hating joooo, right Diane?
joyce on June 9, 2006 at 8:00 PM
Actually jhoyce, I wondered if YOU knew it? I thought he was. See, I'm not the jooooo hater at all...it's you who hate anyone, including Jews, apparently, who aren't on 'your side of the argument'.
You're so dang duplicitous, Joyce. And why do you say jooooooooooo instead of Jew? Is it hard for you to spell it out?
janet on June 8, 2006 at 4:09 PM
Stop telling people who disagree with your sadistic war they should leave the country.
You leave it, lady.
Hey Diane the Moronlady, did you not see or remember the streets in the Middle East after 9/11 and all of the idiots clapping and cheering when the Towers came down ?
I suppose that was just ?
If President Bush was an idiot or a killer, like the majority of you leftys think he is, he would have done what I want and make the Middle East a GLASS PARKING LOT, then all the Religious fanatics can be dead and Allah can sort em' out !
I am the one tired of the Left- tree hugging, give peace a chance bullshit spewers with the double talk and the lies. You are all a bunch of spineless, mindless morons.
Be happy you have a leader who is more worried about the safety of this nation than making everyone happy, basically being a politician.
Muslims haven't done anything to us? News to me. I look back at recent history and see a bunch of instances of "the religion of peace" terrorizing the world.
As for killing Iraqis "wholesale", if we really did that, they'd all be dead today. It wouldn't be that hard for our military to wipe out 25 million people.
Alot of them got into the military for an education or job...
Well, tough shit for those guys. Unlucky for them that they were actually called to duty. You don't mention the record high re-enlistment rates though...wonder why?
...without ever dreaming they would be sent by a Dufus to an immoral, illegal, anti-Constitutional occupation.
Great argument there. Not only do you call our President a "Dufus", but you twist the meanings of the words "immoral", "illegal", and "anti-Constitutional" to be the exact opposite of reality.
See, I'm not the jooooo hater at all...it's you who hate anyone, including Jews, apparently, who aren't on 'your side of the argument'.
Wait, when it's not the "Jewish PNAC's" who are "on our side", they're not on our side? Ummm..whatever.
Stop telling people who disagree with your sadistic war they should leave the country.
"Sadistic"? This war has been remarkably clean on our end with only a few blights. I guess you could call it sadistic in one respect: when the wounded enemy stops shooting, we rush in to give him medical aid.
You leave it, lady.
Why would Joyce have to leave? She's not a terrorist supporting communist. Michael Berg is. Berg should leave. He hates everything this country stands for.
As a "person who joined the military to get an education" and a war monger/baby killer etc.etc. who has been to Iraq.I have this too say...Unfortunately you liberals wont like this.So turn away now.
Nick Berg was a stupid asshole who went to Iraq looking too make money.He went without government sanction.When the government advised him too take his stupid ass home he did his own thing and got his head cut off for his choices,While i find this act despicable he did bring it on himself.Look at his demographics...Jewish and American in a country where they hate both with equal veracity....duh!!
He brought his fate on himself.For his father to blame the government for his death is total BS.He was an adult who made his own competent descision and suffered the consequences as a result.Im tired of libs preaching free mind then when it blows up in some ones face its everyones fault but the individual that made that decision.
As it has been pointed out previously Mr. Berg is a jew.I am sure this will be called "anti-semetic" but for the cries about the Halocaust,which did happen....I have been too Dachau and felt the death there.Why do our Jewish politicians such as Mr. Berg call for Gun Control...which was a Nazi Party plank and made the jews victims since they gave up thier guns when Hitler demanded it,and abortion rights which is the murder of innocents such as the Halocaust was.Pacifism is a nice idea but it has been realistically out of style since Cain dropped Abel.For all the libs that want to scream about racism etc.I promise you my babygirl is black and I love her for life.I am conservative but as I watch the so called conservatives self destruct over greed,and the libs try to turn this country into the Soviet Union,I am just a soldier keeping my watch.Oh by the way...Im a medic...A non-combatant and I willingly choose to serve my country in the fashion.Perhaps civilian non-combatants like Mr.Berg need to relocate themselves to France...Im sure he would be welcome there.
Just A Medic
Me
Thank you for your service. Regardless of what other consequences you may have endured since, please know that there are many of us who do appreciate your sacrifice.
This is an outrage and if this had been done to a couple terrorists held in Gitmo, no doubt Muslim fanatics from Tehran to Islamobad would be out in the streets threatening death to Americans. Well, it's not the average American's thing to take their anger to the streets and beat our chests bloody with rage, but we will be happy to bloody the enemy that did that attrocity.
What follows will be done in a steely calm. It will be done carefully and deliberately. It is taking shape at this moment, somewhere, in a secure strategic operations room, far from the media and the primitive terrorists, who mistakenly think they are out of reach of justice. If they could only see what the future holds for them, it would be far more disturbing than a mere mob chanting death threats.
We the people, acting through our President and our military will soon take care of what must be done. When it is over, it will not be punctuated by bravado or politicizing, it will simply be closure for the victim's families and an end to the unremarkable lives of a few insignificant, but truly evil fanatics.