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The reason for ultrasound and for heartbeat audibility is to give a visceral emotional connection point to make going through with an abortion harder. No one has a constitutional right to the medical world making your choices emotionally easier, especially the termination of another life.
That so many out in the country want to bury their head in shit and pretend is testament to how retarded this nation has become. They hold protest marches against soldiers dying in war (where else would a soldier die) but pay no attention to murders going on all about the nation right here.
Several years ago, I was involved in seeing a woman through the abortion process. The (De)Planned Parenthood clinic she went to had ultrasound machines in every examination room I saw. Plus, afterwards, they sent me two free movie tickets for my participation.
Priorities, I guess.
First, Rob is no Jesus freak, he is an atheist! So, now what? Kind of knocks you on your arse doesn't it?
Next, I suspect you would probably object loudly, passionately and often if a man shot an infant an killed it the day it was delivered from the womb. Yet, you get all upset when people object loudly, passionately and often when you kill that same innocent baby inside your womb because it is economically inconvenient and/or you were too stupid and lazy to use birth control. Murder is murder, it is not just a legal matter, but a moral issue, one enshrined in our National Charter and Constitution that guarantees everyone an equal chance at LIFE.
If that life inside your womb is not a human being, then you have no legal claims if by negligence someone causes you to spontaneously abort that child, nor should society have any charges of homicide or manslaughter against someone (your lover) kicking you in the gut and causing you to spontaneously abort your baby. It is either a life all the time while it is in your womb or it is never a life, which is it?
It may be your womb, but that innocent child should have a right to live despite your immoral and selfish lifestyle. If you terminate that life, you are guilty of homicide!
What bothers you is that once the mother realizes that child is a living human being with feelings, more of them will [b]not[/b] get an abortion and your side will be unable to continue the mass extermination of innocent human beings under the oh so kind label of abortion!
Nonsensical verbal gymnatstics and a waste of time! It is a HUMAN BEING from conception to birth. If it is a fetus 1 second before birth and a baby 1 second after birth, it is a human being all the time.
[quote]how can you say a wasted sperm is not a baby lost[/quote]
As a matter of absolute fact, the Judeo-Christian God speaks against deliberately spilling seed upon the ground (masturbation) because it might have joined with a woman's egg and started the process to producing a human life in hr womb. Not that one goes to hell for masturbation, but rather that God calls that sperm potential life.
Let's put your money where your orifice is:
First, let's later-term abort your nasty ass.
Second, whatever is left of you has to spend an afternoon in conversation with Nieman.
Then report back to us and tell us which you really think is worse.
You support a woman controlling "her own body"? Try telling a pro-choice woman that she should keep her pants on, and see how the idea of "control" of her own body sits.
A woman's egg has the capability to produce life too. Is menstruation a sin?
If a man doesn't masturbate, his body "spills" the sperm for him. God didn't create an inherently futile system Neiman. Doesn't that make your premise kind of flawed?
Then they can decide if they want to support it or go through with it.
Click HERE if you want to see what late-term abortions look like or click HERE to see what regular abortions look like. It is VERY graphic so I will warn you up front.
I believe people who support abortions should view this, even view the video footage of the baby jerking as the tube is inserted in to the back of its head as it is partially pulled from the womb and the head collapsed or the dismembering of the arms and legs and other parts inside the womb.
Viewing should be mandatory for those who support this or wish to have it done.
Have we become so desensitized as a nation we no longer feel anything when seeing these acts of horror?
The reason the Fargo Killing station is objecting is because in all states that have this law....abortions have gone down and they have lost revenue.
Women's reproductive rights my ass, this is about money! Give me a break. If you don't want a baby, don't get pregnant. It's as simple as that.
Nonsensical verbal gymnatstics and a waste of time! It is a HUMAN BEING from conception to birth. If it is a fetus 1 second before birth and a baby 1 second after birth, it is a human being all the time.[/quote]
NO!!! YOUR side says its the POTENTIAL of a kid that maters. take the thing out of the mommy two months after conception and keep it alive. you cant. Now, please address this wonderful fact... based on YOUR potential child (see below).
[quote]A woman's egg has the capability to produce life too. Is menstruation a sin?
If a man doesn't masturbate, his body "spills" the sperm for him. God didn't create an inherently futile system Neiman. Doesn't that make your premise kind of flawed?[/quote]
WE HAVE A WINNER! take the God stuff out of it though. that was my exact point and he chose to ignore it totally. A woman KILLS a baby every month based on their definition of POTENTIAL life. any male MURDERS babies every time he pops. THINK OF THE CHURUN!!!!!! KILLERS!!!!!
[u][b]Now, is it a real baby that can live (even with medical help) or the potential of a baby you care about? You cant have it both ways.......[/b][/u]
The law isn't about safely performing abortions. If it was, what sense would hearing the heartbeat make. It's to prove to these women that it's a life and killing it is wrong.
Logic fail.
[quote]its not a baby until its actually a baby. if its a potential baby at conception, how can you say a wasted sperm is not a baby lost? or ‘that time of the month' resulting in a potential lost soul?[/quote]
This kind of backwards thinking, while meaning to mock Christians and others of faith, instead shows the absolute scientific ignorance of the questioner.
Sperm and eggs are not human cells. They have half the required DNA and chromosomes to create life. When mixed with the OTHER half...they create a unique human life.
"Wasted" sperm would happen every few minutes as old sperm die and new sperm replace them. As Eddie pointed out, ovulation would have to be a sin too.
Of course, wasting sperm is no more a moral issue than spilling blood after you cut yourself. Killing a baby (sperm and eggs are potential babies...not zygotes) is a deeply moral issue.
Morality fail.
You're telling that to an atheist.
Drop your assumptions Michelle. You look like an ass.
And chew on this - It looks like you've got some things that you need to admit because if you support abortion, you do not support controlling one's own body.
Drop your assumptions Michelle. You look like an ass.[/quote]
Hey, attack a woman, that's a classy move!!
She wasn't talking to your stupidass. Quit acting like you know what you are talking about.
Cry about it.
Man or woman, it doesn't matter. An ass is an ass.
She wasn't talking to your stupidass. Quit acting like you know what you are talking about.
Uh, huh?
I'm not even an atheist.
Drop your assumptions "Hannitized". You look like an ass.
Who cares that she's a woman? That has no bearing on anything here. You're just using her gender.
In any regard, she's an assuming abortion supporter. "Ass" is being generous.
It's nice to see who you always take the side of; and that would be assuming abortion supporters, racists, anti-Americans, and a whole laundry list of sundry characters.
Subsequently, your conclusions are asinine.
Kenny, I think you need to make it more simplistic for some people.
Do I call an egg, or the milk, or the other INGREDIENTS it takes to make a cake....do I call these ingredients a cake before its made? No. It is only when mixed together and baked that it becomes the cake.
Arguing sperm or egg is life before the 'mix and making' is as stupid as it comes.
Sperm and eggs are not human cells. They have half the required DNA and chromosomes to create life. When mixed with the OTHER half...they create a unique human life.
"Wasted" sperm would happen every few minutes as old sperm die and new sperm replace them. As Eddie pointed out, ovulation would have to be a sin too.
Of course, wasting sperm is no more a moral issue than spilling blood after you cut yourself. Killing a baby (sperm and eggs are potential babies...not zygotes) is a deeply moral issue.
Morality fail.[/quote]
i think its not a baby until it can survive on its own or with medical help. until then, its only a [b]potential [/b]baby. just like eggs and sperm. to say otherwise is untrue. so you are saying women are killers every month. you should go make a sign and stand outside the mall. it would be fun to watch.
[quote]enny, I think you need to make it more simplistic for some people.
Do I call an egg, or the milk, or the other INGREDIENTS it takes to make a cake....do I call these ingredients a cake before its made? No. It is only when mixed together and baked that it becomes the cake.
Arguing sperm or egg is life before the ‘mix and making' is as stupid as it comes.
[/quote]
er..... no. unless of course you are saying you can have a piece of cake even before you bake it. in your example i dont think a cake is cake until it gets tasty. sure, i have NO problem admitting at some point in the oven it can be eaten, but it wont be good. but that point does not come for a while after you start the baking process.
basically your side MUST not logically argue this. why? because you cant. your whole argument consists of 'because i say so' or 'my god say its wrong'. so stop trying to be logical. you base your side in feelings like the liberals do. now move along to your next hypocritical stance on something else.
Well, pardon the crudeness here, but your "thinking" isn't much of anything to mention. We pointed out the absolute STUPIDITY of comparing wasting sperm (or ovulation) to abortion.
We're NOT saying they're killers every month, any more than people who waste sperm are killers. I repeat:
[quote][b]Sperm and eggs are not human cells[/b]. They have [b]half the required DNA and chromosomes[/b] to create life. [b]When mixed with the OTHER half...they create a unique human life[/b].[/quote]
Get it yet, Jimmy? A zygote is a human life, sperm and eggs aren't even human cells.
Intelligence, morality, and basic thinking skills fail.
[quote]er..... no. unless of course you are saying you can have a piece of cake even before you bake it. in your example i dont think a cake is cake until it gets tasty. sure, i have NO problem admitting at some point in the oven it can be eaten, but it wont be good. but that point does not come for a while after you start the baking process.[/quote]
But no one would claim the raw ingrediants are cake. If you spilled the milk, no one would say "You ruined the cake!" You don't really get simple metaphors, do you?
Literary fail.
[quote]basically your side MUST not logically argue this. why? because you cant. your whole argument consists of ‘because i say so' or ‘my god say its wrong'. so stop trying to be logical. you base your side in feelings like the liberals do. now move along to your next hypocritical stance on something else.[/quote]
Jimmy, we're the only people LOGICALLY arguing this. Again, when the cake is in the oven, and someone asks the baker, what are you doing, he says "I'm baking a cake", not "I put a series of ingrediants in the oven that are as of yet a potential cake, but if everything goes perfectly will soon be a cake. But only if it's yummy." This is not even remotely intelligent talk, and would get an eyebrow raised at the baker.
Science tells us that a unique human life is created at conception. If it implants into the uterian walls, it will grow into a healthy baby boy or girl. It's never NOT a human life, so there's no question about when it becomes one. Only the unscientific and the fools try and determine when it becomes life. ...It already IS.
So we get fake sophestry that would be rejected in any other discription used. It's a baby when it LOOKS human. It's a baby when it can think. It's a baby when it's born. It's human when it can survive on it's own. (12? 14?)
No one refers to an automobile being built as a potential car, or a house being built as a potential house. The vandal who destroys a car on the line or sets the house being built on fire cannot claim, "Well, it really wasn't a house or a car yet. I just stopped it from being...so I've not done anything wrong." He is still guilty of vandalism or arson. We don't speak of our next paycheck as "potential pay", and shrug it off if our boss just decides not to let that "potential check" become a real one. We demand our money. He cannot claim "well, since I never wrote the check, it was never due to you...it was just potentially yours". We'd sue him and report him to the BBB. No one refers to a wedding day as a "potential marriage", and tries to pretend that they do nothing wrong by standing their fiancee up at the alter. Hey it was just potential right?
Why we would speak so ridiculously about a helpless infant life, when we would reject such downright IDIOTIC arguments in any other area of our life? Because it's convenient and allows us to pretend we are not doing evil. It's no different than what the slave owners did (blacks aren't really people), what those committing Genocide do (the Jews aren't human, the Tutsies aren't really human, Non-believers are the children of apes and pigs, not men), what cannibals do (they're food, not people), etc. And shame on you for advocating such evil nonsense.
-from a woman in DC who's head isn't stuck in her ass like all of yours.